To see a new conference launch that brings together like minded individuals in one space to learn and make contacts is something I always like to see, especially if the cost can be covered without remortgaging your house. However upon hearing about the Women on the Web conference my reaction wasn’t so positive.
After reading a tweet from Zoe Piper today I was led on a bit of a reading exercise firstly of Zoe’s post and then Dom Hodgson’s post of which Zoe referenced. Both posts centred on the Women on the Web conference and the minority of women in the web industry.
The Situation
In a nutshell there are too few women in the industry, not through sexism, inability or inexperience. Instead it’s because the majority of women when looking into careers at 16 to 18 (or whenever) are not excited over sitting in front of a computer and writing code for a login form or a design for the next big social networking website. There exist no barriers for more women to enter the industry; the simple case is most women seem to prefer to do something else.
My Experience
I work in an office of 13 men and one woman (who happens to be the boss) and in the life time of the company no other women have ever been employed there. Of course being red blooded males we would like some more women around, not just for the obvious reasons of having some extra pretty faces and to flirt a bit but because the differing views and opinions that come with the experiences of being a woman could in truth provide better solutions to problems us males may not consider. That added to the fact a woman can be just as good if not better than anyone else in the office adds experience that only makes us as a company better.
Of course in such a male dominated office and industry any female coming in would have to be fairly thick skinned to withstand the male banter that occurs. Truthfully no comment or joke is too crude in our office, and neither should it be because as sensible people we are able to distinguish between a joke and a person’s true opinion no matter the subject.
No men allowed
Some of the justifications put forward for the Women on the Web conference are that some women feel intimidated at ‘mixed’ conferences, this sounds fair enough, I too can feel intimidated at conferences due to a mix of shyness and lack of self confidence. However I don’t stop attending conferences because of this, nor do I start a shy people on the web conference. Instead I carry on going, trying to overcome my own insecurities in the knowledge that not doing so will not solve the problem.
Although I’m sure it’s possible for a man to attend the Women on the Web conference due to discrimination laws its clear the conference is intended to be a female only event to provide a place for women to band together in a safe environment, but not only does it not solve the problem it makes it worse.
By attending such conferences solely they may never integrate into the fuller community and there’s a real chance that by selecting only female speakers they are likely to miss opportunities to invite better speakers who may just happen to be men. Imagine big web entrepreneurs like Kevin Rose (Digg), Larry Page and Sergey Brin (Google), Mark Zuckerberg (Facebook) or even Sir Time Berners-Lee (Godfather of all things web) being turned away from speaking because they are male. That is a huge amount of experience, knowledge and insight to turn away.
Male Discrimination
Note: This goes into a bit of a rant, if it hasn’t already.
For well over a century women have fought for equality, and achieved it. The same goes for the African American population, hello President Obama, and a number of other minorities. Yet the Women on the Web conference if viewed from a certain standpoint would indicate this is not enough, to some this conference is not about empowering women but excluding men. Britain has become too obsessed with ensuring equality that we have ended up with positive discrimination that rather than helping the minorities punishes the majority.
One example that I feel best illustrates this point is the case of the Wimbledon Tennis prize money. Equal pay is what the female Tennis players demanded, which on the face of it sounds fair enough, but not when you highlight the differences. In the Wimbledon Singles Tournament the men play up to 5 sets a match whilst the women play 3. Over 7 rounds this equates to a potential 14 more sets for the men than the women and it’s safe to assume playing more sets takes longer on average. Yet the women players now receive equal pay for doing less work. Is this any different than a man and woman both doing the same job on equal pay in an office, yet the woman leaves work 3 hours before the man. This is not equality it’s discrimination, but because it’s against men people don’t seem to want to rock the boat in fear of offending others.
I could continue to rant about the whole positive discrimination thing but I’ve gone a little off topic.
Peace and Love
I understand all this may not be worded in the best way to keep me out of trouble and I may be seen as just moaning about women who should be at home cooking and cleaning, this isn’t true, the way I see it is everyone is equal and everyone deserves the best opportunities irrespective and despite any differences. If you have the hunger, drive and ability to do something then you should be given the opportunity to do it. Further dividing yourself from the majority only highlights you as the minority.
Although I wish all involved in the Women on the Web conference the biggest success I feel it highlights the problems in our industry but rather than fix any problems it only serves to replicate them in a female dominant sub group of our industry. Instead why not look into levelling the playing field by trying to get more women into the industry, or keep going with the mixed conferences and integrate with the community. Many of those I know in the industry don’t see women as anything other than equals, friends and awesome people.
9 Comments
Good post Kean.
I wonder what would happen if we started a “Men on the Web Conference”!!!
I imagine that wouldn’t go down too well…
David Whitehouse | www.david-whitehouse.org 14th March 2009 @ 6:25 pm
Unfortunately that is the problem such a conference would not go down well, yet when in the case of this conference the roles are reversed we are expected to just accept it.
Kean 14th March 2009 @ 7:03 pm
Not all women have pretty faces. And not all women are interested in men. And not all women want to be flirted with in the workplace.
And with 13 men in your office, the statistics are against your idea that they are all “red blooded males”, as you put it.
If you think women have achieved equality, I think you’re just not paying attention. And the idea that African Americans are now magically equal because of Obama, is frankly laughable.
John Leach | johnleach.co.uk 16th March 2009 @ 5:42 pm
Good points.
I find this whole thing over women in tech ridiculous. One of the major reason I gave up trying to get into IT 3 years ago was down to *one* stupid male tutor at college who didn’t want girls in his classes. Because of the mental health problems he caused I didn’t even try to finish my Computing A-level, but pushed on with my career in Photography.
Since then I’ve not shied away from the tech community – my other half is a web dev, most of my friends work in the industry and I go to GeekUp Manc practically ever month. I’ve still to see what GGD are like, so I can’t really talk about it as a good or a bad thing other than in theory.
The theory of a woman’s only conference worries me – having spent so long trying to get equality to then say “no, you men aren’t pleasant enough to us” or that their POV aren’t needed as they can’t bare children – that just seem Wrong.
Well that’s my 2cent about it,
Cat
Cat Ashton | www.catashton.co.uk 16th March 2009 @ 6:45 pm
I personally don’t see the problem with it. The web industry isn’t typically regarded as an industry in which you find females, similarly to other tech industries, and I can see it as being daunting to those who do wish to persue a career in it.
Unfortunately women aren’t treated equally which is why a male typically attracts a higher salary than an equally qualified and experienced female. Aside from the salary expectations there is the threat of sexual harassment (perhaps perceived as flirting by some) and discrimination from an office full of ‘red blooded males’.
Could the reason that no women have been employed at your office (other than your boss) be due to the risk of employing a female? WIth the potential flirting and crude banter that you suggest happens in your office, your employee would be treading on egg shells in case of a law suit against them.
If conferences like Women on the Web encourage females to pursue a career in the web industry and it allows them to overcome the fear of them being the only ‘ones’ then I see it as being a good thing.
Scott Mallinson | www.scottmallinson.com 16th March 2009 @ 8:13 pm
Hey Kean, great post – it’s good to hear things from a man’s point of view – (you’re either part of the problem or the solution in an argument like this one!).
It’s interesting what you say about banter in the office – it’s been commented that this is exactly what can make it uncomfortable for women to work there. What you describe is exactly what I’ve experienced…men talking about women all day and being completely honest, it has gone too far a couple of times but I put it down to immaturity on the part of the bloke involved. I think you find this anywhere, not just in tech, because some men simply are really sexist. The vast majority however aren’t!
I agree with what you say about positive discrimination – if women want equality – and we do – we should settle for equality and not demand even more. But then, I think men should get the same paternity leave as women, etc etc…
Piggynap | www.piggynap.com 17th March 2009 @ 9:09 am
Some good comments. These and the various blog posts cropping up around Dom’s original have all made some good points, although a lot, my own included, went a little away from the core subject into women in the workplace and discrimination as a whole.
Hopefully the discussion may lead to improvements made in our industry where the gender percentages are equalised a bit. I still believe that other in population Women are truly equal in our industry, as is any other minority be it Black, Gay or Disabled to name only a few. It is true I base this on my personal opinions and there are still racists and sexists around but their antiquated views should not be seen as justification for dividing our community.
In such a young, global and hopefully forward thinking industry there should be no place for these things.
Kean 17th March 2009 @ 8:23 pm
I think you guys must have misunderstood the conference blog at http://womenontheweb.wordpress.com
This is not a conference for women in tech, or technical women, it is in fact completely the opposite. Here’s the relevant quote:
“After the huge success of our first Women on the Web Conference in September 2008, we’ve talked to many women in business and you’ve told us that you want:
* An absolute beginners guide to the various tools and techniques on offer.
* Offered in bite-size chunks.
* In clear English, and making good business sense.
* A variety of tools and techniques so you can pick and choose what’s of interest to you and your business.”
It’s a conference to help women who are completely new to the Web get to grips with it in order to run their own businesses, and have a better chance of success. And if men find themselves in the same boat they are very welcome too.
Also, if any of you more web-enlightened folks – of any gender – can spare some time on Monday 30th March, or on any Tuesday to help out with some seminars and masterclasses. That would be fab.
Everything we do is during school hours so that those with childcare responsibilities are able to attend, and priced to cover costs.
Liz Cable | www.reachfurther.com 18th March 2009 @ 7:55 am
As time has gone on it appears the question really should be ‘What’s in a name?’
Kean 18th March 2009 @ 8:56 am